CLANDEBOYE BUNKER BUSTER (September 9th, 2006)
 

Game starts: 11:00am
Game ends: 5:00pm

Meeting Place: Clandeboye school parking lot, next to the clandeboye store on Hwy 9, North of Winnipeg at 10AM ShARP. Approx 45 minute drive

OBJECTIVES

-Take control of all bunkers.

-Remeber this game is for fun, to sharpen your skills and shoot alot of ammo. These bunkers are are designed in a way that they cannot be taken easily. Team work is highly recommended.


RULES OF THE PLAYING FIELD

-Eye protection must be used at ALL times inside the gaming area. (NO EXCEPTIONS)

-Gameplay can be stopped at anytime.

-All guns have to be under 400FPS (As per MAA regulations). All guns will be chronographed prior to gameplay.

-Everyone must play in a sportsman-like manner, remember this is just a game.

-No pointing of any guns and or shooting of referees on or off the field.

-Players must remain inside the boundaries of t he game area marked by bright orange tags.

-No loaded weapons outside of the game area PERIOD.

-If rules are not followed, the player will be asked to leave immediately.

-Smoke and frag grenades are allowed AFTER first being approved by the referees. Please submit projectiles devices to referees prior to the game for review.

-No camping outside of opposiing teams respond area.

-Do not leave any trash behind. (Clean up after yourselves)


Admission Fee: FREE (For those with personal equpiment)

Rental Fee: $65
Includes:
-Weapon (AK74 or CA33)
-Tactical Helmet
-Facemask/Goggle
-Tactical vest
-BB magazines X4
-1000 rounds of ammo
-Meal and beverages

495FPS?? Is that a typo?

You're a typo.

I think he meant 395fps.

I'll typo you dinger

I'm game.

I just have to find out whether or not my sister-in-law is getting married that Saturday, or the one before it.

There's going to be respond areas? Meaning I can get better cell phone reception there? :D

Im in

Ill think about it. I have to see if I can get the time off from work.

so is this going to be one long game, or a series of short games?

I'm just typing off the info sheet that I got provided. But pretty much those are the rules.

Zekk, I'm guessing it's one long game, and I guess if it ends sooner, we would just restart it?

Please REGISTER at Xtreme Tactics tho if you are interested in playing just so we have a more solid count.


Thank you,


Gord

Is this an XT game or some other group?

My understanding is that it's being done by the group from SIR??

This is not a typo. Apparently the guys hosting allow guns shooting that hot although I'm not aware of any that actual do shoot that fast. That's 5 FPS away from being a registerable firearm.

Oh joy! Where's my old-skool Systema M150? I can slap that back in my AK in 20 minutes. Yay to broken fingers and knocked-out teeth!

:rolleyes:

uhmm.. yah, about that. I think i'll prolly sit this one out.

As I said on the MAA Forum:

"The only two concerns I have are the obvious 495 limit and no ammo restrictions. That can lead to some one seriously getting hurt. These are things to fix in order to make the game enjoyable.

Hakken's right though, bunker busting usually involves close some close quarters battle at some point and that's when you're not going to want guns shooting that hot."

Ok, thanks for the info Trip.

That's why you let the hyperactive rookies go in first ;) .

Like operation human shield.

Right. I'll just do what I do best.

KAMIKAZEEEEEE!!!

Firstly let me apologize as I have some involvements about the ranting that this post has caused.

He stated 495FPS “as per federal law” on his poster (which I copied). I didn’t post that part worrying that it would cause more confusion and outrage, but I guess this situation is a double edged sword.

When I read the poster and obviously asked him about the FPS limit and his intention with it. To sum it up, pretty much he didn’t know exactly what he’s doing. He wrote it as a MAX FPS, he hasn’t been involved in any structured airsoft game to truly understand what actually needs to be done and how to run things. Ex. The different “stages of FPS we allow”

Think of it on this sense. Before the MAA was established, we just started off having scrims out on private property. We didn’t have any “rules and regulations”. Everything was based on trust and self government. Everyone knew that the guns had to be fired under 495FPS, but nobody really had a chronograph to test and we just “judge” how hot it was shooting by the pain factor. That or when we know it’s shooting hot; we set a better engagement distance for ourselves. Back in the day before airsoft was mainstream we didn’t have the need to have all these rules in regulations. But like anything in life, rules and regulations are required in society to maintain proper order of things.

Which leads to “why” XT is supporting this game? What situation would you rather see?

a) A bunch of new players gathering with minimal rules and structures.

b) A bunch of new players guided by those with rules and structure “knowing” that one day these new players will slowly evolve developing the same sense and standard we see threw our eyes.

Now I know for a FACT that nobody in his crew has something that shoots over 400FPS (they are all customers who passes by the XT threshold and our policy is to communicate with the customers, get to know them and their weapons (chrono) so we can judge what step we should take next with these individuals). That is our job. In fact everyone one of you who has been to XT has been in the same filtering/educating process. And I hope you all trust my judgement when I deem Jay (SIR guy) as NOT a threat to the airsoft community. You guys just need to understand his “personality/style” more so before you judge. Trust me, he’s a good guy. If I don’t deem someone responsible, they wouldn’t be getting any help from me in general. And we would shy them away. Obviously as a public business I can’t just “ban/boycott” by saying “I don’t like your face” (for the lack of a better term). Everyone deserves a chance, and it is up to themselves to see if they fit in this community.

KEEP IN MIND, that this is one new guy trying to organize a semi large scale event. This is quite the difficult task to do especially when you lack the experience. So PLEASE don’t judge this game with a set of filtering eyes.

Not all airsoft groups can do such a difficult task. Big props to Hellfish once again. Operation Prairie wind was one of the BEST airsoft events I have ever attended (FYI, I have attended airsoft events across the Nation). Rules and structures were explained clearly, the organization was top notch; it was just an awesome game overall. The thing that blows my mind the most is the fact that this OP was ran by a bunch of NEW players who has never organized such a large scale event before. Yet it seems every hole and imperfection was planned/prepared for. I only hope structure like this would be passed on so WE can make the airsoft community stronger as a whole. We are all fighting for the same cause. So why make such a big deal on something so little? Lack of airsoft education and experience is the only problem I see here. Nothing more.

And for future references. IF anyone has any problems with subjects they have an issue with, contact me directly before you jump to conclusions. This way, you all get to avoid brewing a new situation in your head and jumping to conclusions. You all know how to get a hold of me; it’s not a hard task to do. So please, get the facts right before you start a rant.


Thank you

Need a BBQ lighter?

Gord,

Being a newwer player myself, I dont know how far my opinions would go, but Id like to add my quick 2 cents.

There are basically 2 reasons why gamers have decided not to attend this event,
a) the "i hate your face" clause
and
b) the max velocity allowed and the serious injury that could follow.

If the organizer(s) could be spoken to about the max FPS and educate them as to what kind of damage velocities over 400fps can cause.. and why the MAA caps ours at 400fps (or whatever the max energy level is) to convince them to lowwer the maximum allowed velocity... there would already be more support from the community and may show just enough responsibility on their behalf to win over some others.

Damn me not being able to edit my posts. My comment is in reference to my brother's comment, not Zeta's.

I agree with you 100% which is why we are supporting it, so we can factor in these issues.

Once again the MAX 495FPS rule was just slapped on without thinking. Hopefully we (the airsoft community) could educate and change that. At least if XT gives support to this, we can lend a hand. Instead of them going off doing whatever it is that they do.

As bad as people might think, common sense still applies to alot of people. And I am certain that they are not going to bring it to a point where people/players get hurt. They are just trying to get accepted and hope to help this community grow (by starting a new field).

But I hope you guys know the fine line between "supporting/education" and "boycotting".


Thank you,

Well said Gord.

Agreed.

Just to let everyone know I have gone out and played a game with the guys who are putting this game on. I found no problems with the fps there guns were shooting at. I really don't think theres anything to worry about and dout anyone will be playing with that sort of fps.

Thats not the point. With a field limit of 500fps, someone coming from somewheres else could bring a hot gun shooting 495. Rules say its legal.. so he can use it. And then someones gonna get hurt. Theres a reason why the MAA fields play with a max of 400 on full auto guns (.2grams).

UPDATE:

Jay was at XT last night chatting. And something I find interesting came up. He mentioned that one of the guys he plays with has an upgraded gun that shoots 395FPS (Chrono’ed by us) and he said in these exact words “we told him to put that shit away because nobody wants to get shot by that thing! It leaves big welts!”

Now please note that he was not aware of all the shit that has happened concerning his FPS rule, so he is not “changing his words around” to make it sound better. That’s truly how he felt. A 395FPS gun is too hot and he doesn’t want people playing with it.

Zekk, your still forgetting the fact that 495FPS was just a number tossed in the air. The actual rules are not going be like that. (if you read the previous post, the organizer thinks 395FPS is too much).

He stated that because it's the limit for airsoft/bb guns to be legal.

What OnePunch meant was that he's played with them and they arn't bad guys nor do they use high FPS. NOT "I'm a macho man and I can take high FPS!"

Do you honestly think I would be supporting a game that allows such a high FPS to be used? When people could potentally be hurt? Also both Jay and I would be providing a chrono at the game (which is what I meant by "supporting", I just thought that was clear to most people).

I hope you expect more of me then that. I am labelled "MR. SAFETY Gord" FYI. hahahha

If I freak about about things like how mercy rules should be involved, god knows I won't tolerate high FPS.

I just didn't feel right to "modify what the guy's orginal poster" because it was against my own morals.

Any one know if its going to be 18+??

Thanks alot.. got a few people intrested.


Yes you have to be 18+, sorry. Rules for outdoors is different.

Gord

Here's my perspective of this situation:

When the MAA posts games there is the obvious rule that you can't have a gun shooting over 500 FPS as it's considered a real firearm at this point - it's not mentioned, it's just common knowledge. No one wants to deal with making their gun registerable.

Now in addition to that unwritten rule, we also have the auto's FPS limits and the fixed semi auto and bolt action limits aswell. We have all these rules in place because we've been around long enough (and I'm talking the handful of us that started off playing without any rules, we know who we are) to understand now what it takes to put on a game and what safety factors are required in order for a game to go off without a hitch.

All the stories and rumours about SIR aside, this was a posted game with the unwritten rule simply being written. Being their first one, I'm willing to cut them some slack. It's common knowledge that our guns aren't to be shooting 495-500 FPS to us because we host games all the time and our airsoft world is more evolved than theirs. I'm pretty sure this group didn't take into account that it's smart/fair, whatever word you want to use, to set other limts besides the obvious one. And I was also there the othe rnight when Jay was commenting on one of his guys shooting way too fast and that being at 390. I do upgrades all the tiem for people getting their guns just under 400. And yes these are MAA or MAA "associates". So it's safe to say he's on our level there.

Rather than bitching about it and getting all offended, it's better to offer advice on enhancing the game rather than trying to destroy it. We wouldn't appreciate someone looking outside-in on us and trying to destroy us. We're far from perfect and there are many ways people could try and take us (MAA) down. People seem to think that because the MAA is the large body of airsoft players that we control or regulate shit when the word airsoft is thrown into a conversation. NO ONE actually controls anything and there's no way to enforce our rules on anyone. All we can do is try and look out for one another. And I don't think we've even attempted to try and help fix the problem here. Right away some went on the rampage without first trying to help. But we've been around long enough that people should be willing enough to listen to any constructive feedback that we might have to offer as long as it's not just bitching and boycotting. I support the MAA, but I don't support that piss poor attitude which unfortunately many seem to have.

I have to cut this short (lol) so hopefully i got my point out somewhere in there.

Sometimes common logic should apply when you think about bothersome situations.

Why are we so protective of our sport?

Because:
a) We love it and MADE airsoft apart of our lifestyle.
b) We have invested lots of money into the sport and it would be stupid of us to mess things up for ourselves.

Now think of this. Does Jay meet both requirement a & b? YES. If not he won't be trying so hard to push airsoft the way he does. Or to open up a new field of us (Airsofters) to play at. And judging by the guns and kits he owns, he has probably spent more $$$ then a majority of us out here. This means he should be “more afraid” of losing his stuff. He has also spent countless hours developing his field on his own! Just so everyone can have a good game. Exactly what some of you did when KS:2.5 was on its way. I'm sure after all the construction your bodies were all wasted and tired. Yet you don't regret one moment of it because you know that when game time comes, players will appreciate it and most importantly you will feel a sense of self satisfaction.

I probably meet requirements a & b the most because my life revolves around it (Literally). So why would I want to take any risk that might cost me any of this? Ask yourself that.

Curiousity sake, is this 16+ or 18+? Ive got some younger folk asking me about this and Im not sure what to say.

Its 18+ as Gord stated above on the edited post. But yeah... Would there be any exeptions to the rules? I have some buddies who are not yet 18 but want to come out because they dont need very much gear for this and can rent the guns.

As was stated it is 18+. I highly doubt there will be exceptions.

I've gone and played at jay's field and to be honest, i liked it ALOT more than OP:PW. There is a decent amount of brush to give you cover, and more than enough underbrush for you to duck under when the situation gets intense. The bunkers themselvs are VERY well made, it is extremely hard to shoot someone that is inside them, but also decently hard to shoot out of. Jay and the guys out there play with the mercy rule, and are more than honest about calling hits
(I shot at jay one time, and he couldnt tell if it was a bb, or a branch when he hit the dirt, so he called his hit.)

so over-all it is usually a very good experience to play out at his field, and hopefully i'll be able to make it to this game if jay/xt allows me to join in.

Seen change at first post didnt see that when I posted above. GJ much better.

;) ;) ;)